'Two Kinds Of Lapses'

Concluding remarks by the home minister in Rajya Sabha -- unedited,verbatim

Mr.Chairman, Sir, I wish to thank all the hon. Members who have spoken inthis debate since this morning. I also wish to apologise that I was notpresent for most of the day, as I was required to be present in the LokSabha. I believe my colleague was here and I have also looked at thenotes of the speeches.

Sir, it is very heartening that all sections of the House have showngreat unity of purpose and have offered support to the Government inthe measures that Government will take to stamp out terrorism in thiscountry. Sir, as I said in the statement which was made in the morning,the evidence that we have gathered so far unmistakably, unerringlypoints to the territory of one neighbour, Pakistan. When I say that, it isnot in a spirit of acrimony or a sense of revenge, I say that with greatpain that despite efforts over the last many years by successiveGovernments to restore normal law to build good relations with Pakistan,the territory of that country is being used to launch terrorist attacksagainst India. There have been successive Governments in Pakistan.Some Governments actively supported these terrorists, some sponsoredthem, some pretended that these terrorists do not exist and the presentGovernment says, 'these are non-State actors'. Sir, non State-actorsare not Stateless persons. Non-State actors also belong to a State.Therefore, we hold the Government of Pakistan responsible for theactions of these terrorists even if Pakistan were to describe them as'non-State actors.' The territory of no country can be made available forlaunching terrorist actions against any other country. Sir, the UnitedNations Resolution 1373 is very clear, and every country is obliged toensure that its territory is not used for terrorist actions against any othercountry.

There is much to be done. How dowe deal with Pakistan? Fortunately, we have been able to build, in thelast two weeks, enormous goodwill and support for India in taking upthis issue with Pakistan. Many Prime Ministers, Presidents and ForeignMinisters have been in touch with our Prime Minister and our ForeignMinister. Many interlocutors have offered their good offices. I think, Sir,we should allow diplomacy and our friendly interlocutors some space toprevail upon Pakistan to crack down upon these terrorists. There issome information flowing from Pakistan, not entirely credible, but still,there is still some information flowing from Pakistan which says thatsome people have been put under house arrest and some have beenarrested. These have to be verified, but I think the correct course iswhat the External Affairs Minister said this morning-- to allow space fordiplomacy and the interlocutors to prevail upon Pakistan to crack downupon those who are using Pakistani territory. If the Government ofPakistan is genuine in its claim that these are non-State actors, then theGovernment of Pakistan is all the more free to take action against thesenon-State actors. Nevertheless, I am clear in my mind that theperpetrators of terrorist acts cannot go unpunished. There is a cost andthey must realise there will be a cost. But for the present, I would urgethe House to support the Government while it, through diplomatic andother means, makes these efforts to prevail upon the PakistanGovernment to crack down upon terrorists.

Sir, there is much to be done here. And, I am glad that there hasbeen no finger pointing or blaming each other. There have been terroristincidents for many years. The one that happened in Mumbai is, ofcourse, the most heinous one. Since it happened in our watch, when weare in Government, I had no hesitation on my visit to Mumbai, to tell thepeople of Mumbai, 'I am sorry; I am sorry for what has happened'. Wetake responsibility and I said, we will strain every nerve to ensure thatthese incidents don't happen in the future.

There are two kinds of lapses and I am sure, friends who havebeen in Government know this. One kind of lapse is systemic lapse. Oursystems are not good enough. A number of people have pointed out,and I think, quite rightly, whatever the other falls of that administration,after 9/11, there has been no terrorist attack on mainland United States.Why? To the best of my understanding, they have put in place verytough rigorous systems. What is important is, nearly all the people of theUnited States and nearly all those who visit the United States acceptthat system. We are sometimes too tolerant, too democratic and tooopen. I know that if a security officer frisks some of us, we takeobjection. Why should we take objection? My own experience is,normally I go through because I am a Minister, but there have beenoccasions when a security officer did not recognise me as one-- and Iam happy that there are some who do not recognise me as one-- hasfrisked me and I have not protested. Why should we protest?

We protest and I have seen this,time and again, in many walks of life. We encourage drivers to jump redlights. In daily life, it is not uncommon for people to talk their way orbribe their way when they are held up for a traffic offence. I think whatis important is when we put in place stronger and more rigoroussystems, as a people, we must learn to accept it. That is the price wewill have to pay if we want a secure country. We have 7500 kilometresof coastline. We have a huge air space. We have got porous borderswith Bangladesh and Nepal, and in Rajasthan. Sri Lanka is barely half an hour away by a country boat. The security of this country, while wehave entrusted to the security forces, we must also cooperate whilesystems are put in place. And, when I talk about systems, it is not onlysecurity systems; it is the system of Administration also. These aresystemic lapses that have taken place. That is the first kind of lapse.My effort, in the last few days, has been to identify and plug thesesystemic lapses.

The second kind of lapse is worse. The second kind of lapse is:we simply don't take decisions. Sometimes, we are paralysed intoindecision. We constantly look over our shoulder; what will the CVCsay, what will the C&AG say, what will the CBI say? How do we run aGovernment? How can anyone run a Government? Our friends therehave been in Government. We must take decisions. We makemistakes. But, I think it is much better to take a decision and some ofthem being mistaken than not to take a decision at all. I assure theHouse that the decisions will be taken, as long as I preside over theHome Ministry, and I will come back to you and tell you what thedecisions are. If one or two decisions turn out to be not very wisedecisions, I will accept the responsibility, but decisions must be taken,decisions must be implemented. For example, Shri Jaswant Singhmentions in his book about the Joint Working Group on terrorismpromised to him by his friend, Mr. Strobe Talbot, and then, used that.Nothing came out of the JWG. I am sure Mr. Arun Shourie was aMember of the Cabinet at that time and many of the suggestions hemade this morning, he must have made in his own Government. Whathappened to the JWG? The only explanation I can give is that the JWGfell into the same kind of mode that we are accustomed to, that is, themode of indecision. The time has come to take hard decisions -- I amnot saying 'harsh decisions' -- and I have said in my statement that inthe next few weeks, the next few months, I will take hard decisions.And, I would expect that all those, who are required to implement thosedecisions, would implement them faithfully.

Sir, most of what I wanted to say has been said. There are somecontroversial suggestions, I am told, which my friend, Mr. Arun Shourie,has made. Well, if Arun does not make controversial suggestions, it willbe a very insipid speech. I think he claims a right to make the mostcontroversial suggestions in any debate. I have great respect for Mr.Arun Shourie and his patriotism and his love for the country. But,surely, the answer is not an eye for an eye. Mahatma Gandhi said, "Aneye for an eye will leave the whole world blind." We must have the rightto defend ourselves, we have a right to protect ourselves and we will dothat. At the same time, we do not wish ill on the people of Pakistan. We wish them well. We want them to have a Government. They havefinally put together some kind of Government. I hope it is a stableGovernment. We want them to have a democratic Government. But, Itake note of Mr. Shourie's suggestions as well as the suggestions madeby a number of people - Mr. Sitaram Yechury, Mr. Sharad Yadav, Mr.Manohar Joshi. I take note of these suggestionsand I will do my best to see as to how many of these suggestions canbe accommodated while we take decisions to strengthen the securitysystem of this country.

Sir, it is past 9 o' clock. Statement is there. The Prime Ministerhas intervened in the other House. Finally, I just want to leave onethought.

The police forces of this country belong to the same stock towhich you and I belong. They are Gujaratis, Marathis, Tamils, Bengalis,Biharis; they come from the same background from which every otherIndian comes from. Some of them have their failings. They work longhours, usually 12 to 14 hours. They are housed in the most appallingconditions. I visited the Police Colony to call on a family of a constablewho laid down his life. It is an old building, fumbling building; smallapartments. They are not very well paid. Certainly, not well equipped.They are not a highly motivated force. Certainly, not all of them arehighly motivated and they have their failings. Yet, these are the menwho are willing to lay down their lives to save other lives.

M.C. Sharma was one such man, Hemant Karkare was one suchman. Unfortunately, there was an attempt to damage the reputation ofM.C. Sharma. Equally, there was an attempt to damage the reputationof Hemant Karkare; and, that pain me most. When I called on HemantKarkare's widow and family, she has a daughter who is married andliving in Boston, another daughter is studying in the London School ofEconomics, and, a son in the 12th standard. Mrs. Karkare is aneducated lady. Talking to them, I found that they were deeply shatteredby the death of Karkare but they were deeply humiliated that in the dayspreceding his death, there was an attempt to damage his reputation.My appeal to all Members is that in the four or five months that Iwill be in the Home Ministry -- there will be a new Government after that-- I have to motivate this force, to lift itself up and secure this country. Ihave to work with these agencies, I have to work with the CRPF, I haveto work with the BSF, I have to work with the State Police. We will tryto give them more money, we will certainly give them better uniforms,better bullet-proof jackets, better equipments, better guns. We will tryto give them better housing but more than anything, we must give themmore respect, better respect. I would urge the people of India and theMembers of this House to please support the Government while we tryto improve the working conditions and the fighting conditions of oursecurity forces, who alone can secure the territorial integrity and thesecurity of this country. With these words, Sir, I, once again, thank you.

Sir, may I make one statement? Somefriends from Assam did make a mention in his debate. This subjectlisted today was only on the Mumbai terrorist attacks. In the otherHouse, we have agreed to have a separate statement and discussion onAssam. If the Chairman decides, we can have a separate discussion onAssam. Be that as it may, I have already had a long discussion with theChief Minister of Assam. I intend to visit Assam immediately after theParliament Session is over, and, I will certainly meet all Members fromAssam and look at their grievances.

Sir, with your leave, may I read the Resolution and request the House to adopt it.