Richard Armitage, the US Deputy Secretary of State at the Pakistan Ministry of Foreign Affairs,Islamabad, Pakistan, May 8, 2003, following his meeting with Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf in Rawalpindi
Khurshid Mahmood Kasuri: Bismillah Rehmanir-Raheem
I'd like to welcome Mr. Armitage, Miss Christina Rocca and other members of the American delegation toPakistan. Mr. Armitage is a friend of Pakistan. He's visited here before many times, and I hope he'll do soagain. Today, Ms. Rocca informed us that she's been to Pakistan 10 times in 12 months. I wish she'd made it 12times in 12 months! And I hope Deputy Secretary Armitage will following her footsteps, but he will have tomake very quick visits in very quick succession. But anyway that's just on the side
But we had very useful discussions today. We covered the whole range of international issues, includingAfghanistan, Iraq and, of course, Pakistan and India. The American delegation had meetings with the President,the Prime Minister and the Foreign Secretary and myself. We had talks in a very good and cordial atmosphere.We covered the whole range of bilateral relations. Both of us agreed there was need for United States andPakistan to think in terms of a long-term relationship. And, quite understandably, there was lot of discussionon recent initiatives by India and Pakistan. And as far as the Pakistan side is concerned, we expressed ourreadiness to initiate a process of dialogue so that all issues of concern to India and Pakistan could beaddressed in a meaningful way, including, of course, the issue of Jammu and Kashmir.
Richard Armitage: Thank you very much, Mr. Minister, for the warm welcome, and as you already said, we have enjoyed a very fullseries of discussions with your good self, the Foreign Secretary, the Prime Minister and, most recently, 90minutes with the President. And we did cover the full range of international issues from Iraq to Afghanistanto the U.N. Security Council and the possibility of a resolution being introduced soon to cover thePost-Saddam Hussein regime in Iraq. Most importantly of all, we were making preparation discussions for thePresident's upcoming visit to Washington - President Musharraf, and, of course, this was all under the rubricof the U.S.-Pakistan bilateral relationship, which I think we both agree is going extraordinarily well. So Ithink that probably a good place for me to stop and for you to start, if you like to ask questions.
Question: Mr. Deputy Secretary, Secretary of State Mr. Colin Powell, when he was here in Islamabad last time, termedKashmir as a dispute on international agenda. I wish to whether, during this trip, are you going to help indisposing of this agenda, since you are going to New Delhi? Should we expect that you will ask Indiangovernment to reduce its aggression in the part of Kashmir controlled by India so that a cooling-off processshould be helped out? Thank you.
Richard Armitage: Thank you. Clearly today, much of the discussion, as the Foreign Minister has already suggested, revolvedaround both the India - Pakistan initiative which was recently undertaken and of course the situation inKashmir. It is not the position of the U.S. government to pressure Pakistan or to pressure India. If we can behelpful in bringing about a dialogue, then that's a good thing. But my discussions here today will befaithfully carried over to our Indian friends, and they can study the comments and what I have to say. Ofcourse, they'll respond in their own way. I want to dispel you the notion that there is pressure from theUnited States. That is not the case.
Question: Can you tell us has Pakistan done enough to stop cross-border incursions into Indian Kashmir, and do youthink the cross-boarder incursion into Indian Kashmir is down?
Richard Armitage: I will give you a direct answer to your question, but -- I tell you, I'm not keeping score with people'slives. I think any violence is too much violence. The infiltration across -- the cross-border violence and thelethality are down from this time last year. That does not fill me with the great enthusiasm, because as Isaid, anybody suffering, I think, is a cause for concern of us all. President Musharraf gave an absoluteassurance that there was nothing happening across the Line of Control, and there were no camps in Azad Kashmir-- and if there were camps, they would be gone tomorrow.
Question: Mr. Armitage, would you agree with the view of many in Pakistan, including President Musharraf (indistinct)on the ground at the LOC that -- the argument for a strong level of (inaudible) should allow India to stopinfiltration because they have, by Pakistani estimates, 20 times more troops in the region, and Pakistan hasdone all that it can. So should India be doing more to stop them coming in?
Richard Armitage: I don't think it's useful for me to point a finger at India or, for that matter, to blame Pakistan for what'sgoing on. We're in a situation that has been brought about by 50-odd years of history. Our whole endeavorhere, the United States, is just to faithfully discuss these issues with both sides of the equation and try toact as just an interlocutor. I'm not going to be in a position of describing whether I think either side hasdone enough. I am just going to put the facts as I hear them on the table.
Question: Mr. Richard Armitage. I am Javed Siddiq, representing Daily Nawa-I-Waqt. You know that the core issuebetween the India and Pakistan is Kashmir. Unless this issue is revolved, the relations between the twocountries can not become normal. So have you brought some concrete proposals which you intend to put beforetwo sides for the solution of this problem?
Richard Armitage: First of all, depending on what side of the question you are on, one side would say it is a core issue. I haveno doubt this is exactly how our friends here in Pakistan feel. I think, from India's point of view, theywould say, if they were here -- as they've said to me -- that their view is it's unrelenting hostility that isthe core issue. So I'm not accepting the premise of what is or isn't a core issue. That's for the partiesthemselves to decide.
And the second part of your question was what -- was I bringing a concrete proposal? The United States is notmaking a proposal in this regard. As I said, the discussions that I have been honored to have with our friendsin Pakistan will be faithfully conveyed to our friends in India, and they can decide how they feel about them.
Question: Mr. Armitage, Omar Farooq from GEO Television. The words you have been using to describe the Pak-Indiadiplomacy is "facilitation." Can you describe this word a little further?
Richard Armitage: No, I don't think I can describe it any further. I guess it's kind of in the eye of the beholder. Let's sayI've come here to discuss a full range of issues. The very serious issue of Kashmir is not the only one I hadat my agenda. As I said, bilateral relations between the U.S. and Pakistan was highest on the agenda, andsecond of all was the question of the President's upcoming visit to Washington.
Question: Last question could be from Aroosa Alam.
Question: Sir, nonproliferation has been a matter of grave concern to USA. And you know India and Pakistan are engagingin nuclear race and arms race. What can you do -- if you are not ready to make any facilitation on yourobligation on Kashmir, what can you do on the nuclear non-proliferation front?
Richard Armitage: Look, I think, when Prime Minister Jamali made his telephone call to the Prime Minister of India, and then thePrime Minister of India made his very far-reaching statement in Srinagar, that something was begun. At least,a nascent, beginning of a dialogue. And a dialogue over time can handle all aspects of a relationship. Andwhat you're suggesting, in terms of arms races, etc..., is sometime that I think is somewhat down the path, interms of discussions to be held between India and Pakistan. There have to be, I think, a series ofconfidence-building measures, political and economic, in other words, before, I think, two states who havebeen in such a general confrontational stance can be expected to make far-reaching decisions on matters ofarms control. But I think what you're seeing, I hope, is beginning of a process, and I'm cautiously optimisticthat is exactly what we're seeing.
Khurshid Mahmood Kasuri: There is one thing I just want to say, because a question was asked about Kashmir. And now we won't go intomodalities, and that's not the right approach. What we are interested in is a process. We are interested ininitiating a process of dialogue. Well, it stands to reason that any solution that does not take intoconsideration the aspirations of the people of Kashmir is not likely to last. So, keeping that in view, as faras the Government of Pakistan is concerned, we would like to go -- we have expressed our readiness to go --into a tiered dialogue, a dialogue which, hopefully, will be meaningful; which will address all issues ofconcern to India and Pakistan.
Thank you.
Question: (cross talk)...Saddam, Iraq. What has been Pakistan's response on that issue? And also, having effectivecontrol of Iraq now and after the killing of several thousand people in Iraq, do you think American regime isunder pressure that they have not found weapons of mass destruction there?
Richard Armitage: There are two questions for your last question! (Laughter) I'll answer the first question on the U.N. SecurityCouncil resolution. Pakistan, very importantly, occupies the Chair in the U.N. Security Council. So I wantedto make sure that we exposed our friends here to our thinking and the British thinking on the way forward fora U.N. Security Council resolution which will govern the situation after the Oil-for-Food Program ends. And ithas several aspects: political, economic, etc... The second part of your question has to do with WMD. We areabsolutely confident of our information. Never have I seen the intelligence agencies of my government and, bythe way, allied governments so united on any one issue as I did on the presence of weapons of mass destructionin Iraq. And you have seen, I think, just in recent days announcements about a mobile van -- one of the thingsthat Secretary Powell spoke about during his 5 February discussions in the U.N. Security Council. This hasturned out to be true. A mobile biological van has been found. So I have absolutely no doubt we'll get to thebottom of it all.
Question: What was the reason for the change in India's stance and view of the belligerent statements coming fromIndian Ministers. And also, sir, do you think that this time there are more chances of the talks beingsuccessful then they have been in the past? And if so, why would you be feeling that way?
Richard Armitage: Madam, all I can say -- I can't answer for our Indian friends. I just note that the Prime Minister of Indiamade a rather far-reaching, and I think to many people surprising, statement in Srinagar. His motives are hisown. I have no doubt that he, himself, is a man of peace and he wants to have peace for India and peacebetween India and Pakistan. Beyond that I can't speculate on his motives. It's something, I think, that ourfriends, once they get into a discussion, will find out for themselves.
And the second part of your question, Madam, was...?
Question: Do you think the talks are going to be more successful this time? Because we have had talks before, and theyhave come to naught in a sense.
Richard Armitage: Well, time will tell. I would pronounce myself as cautiously optimistic that we're at the beginning of whatmight be a very good process. There seems to be a certain confidence in Pakistan, a certain confidence inIndia about the ability to address all aspects of a relationship, and I think that's a very good basis on towhich move forwarded.
