'Russia Is An Old Friend'

The English rendering of the full text of the interview, conducted in Russian and Hindi, courtesy PMO:

Honourable Mr. Prime Minister, thank you very much for finding time for us to have this interview. The Russian President, Mr. Vladimir Putin is about to arrive on his visit to India in a few days. How important do you think will be your talks with him?

We are eagerly waiting for President Putin. We attach great importance to his visit and talks with him. Russia is an old friend of ours. We have a dynamic relationship, which is constantly moving forward, and getting strengthened. There is a great deal of commonality in the views of India and Russia on international questions. We are also working in tandem in the fields of economy and defence. As strategic partners, we will discuss the international scenario. Regional situation and bilateral relations will also figure in talks with him. This discussion will be very significant.

As far as I know, you have met the Russian President quite a few times and have also established a personal rapport with him. How much importance do you attach to this personal rapport in furthering the relations between the two countries?

I have a deep personal relationship with President Putin. We keep meeting regularly. If need be, we talk on the phone. Discussions are always very frank. There is no hesitation in our hearts when we talk. He is a trusted friend and from this point of view our personal relations help in strengthening our political relations.

As far as I know, you had a personal relationship with several Russian leaders of different generations – from Leonid Brezhnev to Vladimir Putin. What do you feel- how have your personal relations with Kremlin leaders changed with times and where do they stand today?  

It’s a matter of great happiness for me that I had the opportunity to meet, exchange views and have frank discussions with Russian leaders from Mr. Brezhnev to President Putin. Whatever changes have taken place, have further strengthened our friendship because our friendship is based on principles and is rooted in protection of mutual interests. This feeling of friendship has stemmed from the resolve to work together and I am happy to note that when I look back, a picture emerges in which there is continuity with change, and along with personal rapport, there is also a policy-related consensus. That is why we attach great value to this visit of PresidentPutin.

Honourable Prime Minister, you have rightly said that with changing times, our two countries have established a strategic partnership. How much do you think will this strategic partnership grow, in which direction and to what extent? 

We are confident that the strategic partnership between us will forge ahead. There is a need to extend this partnership further in the changed international circumstances. Our international ideals are the same and we have been working together in every field and can start working in new areas in the future. We will discuss this with President Putin. How far we can take this strategic partnership to new heights, and add depth to it – all these questions will be discussed. 

Mr. Prime Minister, you have been to Russia several times. You are well acquainted with Moscow. What does our nation mean to you?

I have had the opportunity to visit Russia quite a few times. I have also been to Moscow. Each time my visit has been successful. Russia is a friend, with whom our friendship has always stood the test of time. Our friendship gets a boost by whatever changes that take place in the world. We will discuss about expanding our cooperation. 

Mr. Prime Minister, I would like to ask a few personal questions, with your permission. Your father was a school teacher and your education was of a very high standard. Could tell us how your family and the atmosphere at your home affected your life?

The atmosphere in my family encouraged me to work in public life. It was an atmosphere of education and I studied different types of thoughts. In our family, there used to be discussions from different point of views. As a student, I participated in the movement, which was mainly related to India’s freedom struggle. However, side-by-side, there were discussions on the nature of post-independence India. What will be our relations with other nations – and the fact that we will maintain a close relationship with Russia emerged constantly during these discussions. We have stood by each other through thick and thin. And we understand each other well. No attempts to create misunderstandings between us have succeeded. The frank atmosphere within my family has helped me to adopt this healthy attitude. 

In your younger days, you participated in the freedom struggle, as you told us that at a very tender age, at the age of 16, you were imprisoned. How did you endure the hardships at such a tender age? 

The whole nation was fighting imperialism. Youth were embracing death. Some people were waging an armed struggle against foreign imperialism. Some were struggling to achieve independence by adopting peaceful means of non-violence. I was born and brought up in such an environment. It was natural that as I gained in years, I became a part of the movement. It is correct that I was imprisoned at the age of 16, but I still remember that I was kept in the children’s barrack. The amenities were less, but I did not have to stay there for many days. The Government could not prove the allegations against me. At that time participating in the freedom struggle was like performing a sacred duty. It helped me a great deal in moulding my public life in the future. We are free today. Now in the era of freedom, we have a chance to fulfill the dreams that we had seen earlier. Freedom is just a means, not an end. Freedom gives us the opportunity to fight exploitation and raise our voices against inequality and work for world peace. From the beginning, I got these values from my family, from outside the family and because of that I have been somewhat able to serve the country, humbly and successfully. 

About 50 years back, in 1951, the Bhartiya Jan Sangh was established and you were among those who had established the party. How did you come into politics? What were your objectives, those of your party and the politics of those times?

The struggle for freedom motivated me to enter politics. At that time, Congress was a national forum. People espousing different ideologies used to serve the country through Congress. Initially, I too was associated with Congress. During the college days also, I used to participate in students’ federation. Then, I came to know about the October revolution. A feeling that we have to achieve economic independence also and for that I tried to move forward by participating in student movement. Had the Congress not accepted the partition of India, perhaps my association with it would have continued. But, when the country was partitioned due to imperialist conspiracy, I felt that I should tread a different path. And we entered politics as "Jan Sangh" to build an effective Opposition.

You had been the Foreign Minister during the end of seventies and nineties. You have established yourself as a diplomat of a very high order. You have not only achieved your goals but if need be, you know how to compromise. What according to you is the role of compromise in international relations?   

Firmness is essential in all walks of life and along with firmness flexibility is also required. There has broadly been a general consensus on the question of foreign policy. Therefore, change of guard has not led to any change in foreign policy. That is why, when I got an opportunity as the Foreign Minister, we were ready to follow the policy of non-alignment because non-alignment was not the policy of just one party. During an argument once I told Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru that even if you had not followed non-alignment, the country would have tread it. Now, the country is following this under your leadership, it’s a matter of happiness. Political differences have never distracted us from our foreign policy. Whatever policy direction was needed for country’s larger interests and major issues of the world was taken. A little amount of success has been achieved. All those who helped us in achieving it, deserve thanks. I am happy about whatever contribution I could make.

Mr. Prime Minister, you have been elected to the Parliament eleven times, which is a world record. And I also know that in 1995, you were nominated as the "Best Parliamentarian" of India. In your opinion what are the qualities to become such a good Parliamentarian in whom the people could repose their confidence so many times? What are the qualities required?

There should be a spirit to serve. Commitment towards ideals is required, authenticity is needed and a readiness to work with others and eliciting their cooperation is also required. These qualities are essential and are helpful in moving forward. 

Mr. Prime Minister, I have a slightly different kind of request. You are known not only as a great politician the world over, but people also know you as a very accomplished poet. It would be very nice if you recite for our Russian audience, a few lines from your favourite poem.   

During my youth, I got the motivation to pen down poems during the freedom struggle. These poems were filled with a feeling of love for the country. They depicted a bright future for India. It was more like a discovery of how India could become strong and prosperous. Later on, when political responsibilities increased, the flow of writing poetry ebbed. Still whenever a moment comes, which touches the chords of my heart, touches my innermost self, I pen down a few lines in the form of a poem. I express the moments of disappointment too and also see a ray of hope. I will recite a short poem for your audience:

giit nayaa gaataa huuN
TuuTe hu'e taaroN se
phuuNte basantii swar
patthar kii chhaatii se ug aaya navankur
jhaRe sab piile paat
koyal kii kuuk raat
raatrii meiN arunima kii
ret dekh paataa huuN

The last stanza is:

TuuTe hu'e sapnoN kii sune kaun siski
TuuTe hu'e sapnoN kii sune kaun siski
antar ko chiir vyathaa palkoN par ThiThkii

haar nahiiN manuuNgaa, 
raar nayii ThaanooNgaa, 
kaal ke kapaal par likhtaa, 
miTaata huuN, 
giit nayaa gaataa huuN 

I will not admit defeat
I will wage a new fight
I write and erase on time's forehead 
as I go along, 
I sing a new song

Many many thanks Mr. Prime Minister. I listened to the translation of the poem that you have recited. But perhaps a poem need not be translated. We could understand from its very rhythm that how good is your poem. We are thankful to you for giving us and our viewers a chance to listen to it. I would also like to say that in Russia we have known about India through the Indian films. Indian films are popular in almost every household of Russia. Which Russian of my generation does not know about RajKapoor? At this very moment I can sing before you the whole music of his film "Awara". There was a time inRussia when you could not find even a single child who could not sing many lines of the songs from the film"Awara".

"Awara" has been very popular. Awara’s music was very popular, we all know this and salute the Russian peoples’ sense of appreciating music and art.

Would you be able to tell us which of his films and which one of his songs do you like most ?

It is very difficult to select one particular song out of the many songs because all his songs are very good, attractive and appeal to the heart. I enjoyed a very good relationship with Raj Kapoor. I have been an admirer of his work. I liked his film - "Mera Naam Joker" the most. But as far as the songs are concerned ‘Awara hoon’ is certainly at the top.

You are very right. We feel and have also heard that you have one more hobby dear to you - and that is cooking. Whenever you find time you like to cook certain traditional Hindustani recipes. Would you please tell us, which is your favourite dish, which would you like to cook and eat?

I practiced cooking during my student days. I used to live in a hostel. My father also used to live with me. He liked variety in food and it was my responsibility to cook it. I learned cooking and can claim that I am one of the better cooks. People like food prepared by me. I prefer "Khichdi".   

What type of "Khichdi", ordinary or something very spicy?

Not very spicy but a little spice is required.

I am asking this because when we eat in India, it appears that there is fire all around.

It’s not like that everywhere. Not so much chillies are eaten. I too cannot eat much of chillies, but the food should be somewhat spicy. It is necessary.   

You have put it most aptly. So far as the word "spicy" is concerned we can, in a way, claim that you and I are colleagues. You have been an editor - that too of three papers. You must have come across a chance, when you came across too much of criticism in a newspaper, at that time don’t you remember your own old days of editorship and feel that "no! no! this should have been edited"?

Being an editor I always tried to work with responsibility. I was in Opposition, member of the Opposition party. I did not spare anyone in criticizing but always felt that it was my duty to indulge in constructive criticism without crossing the limits. Whatever I wanted to say, I said very clearly, but used to choose such words in a way that the readers or the listeners do not feel hurt.

As a leader of the country you travel and meet a lot of people. What do you feel – what are the kind of people you like to meet or have felt nice after meeting. Which are the people you feel speak the same language, or think in the same way as you do?

I am in politics. Most of my time is spent with my political friends. I try to elicit everybody’s cooperation in policy making. I also see that India is a big country – a country of great diversities. There are a number of religions, a number of languages. Food habits also vary. We have always underlined the unity in diversity and that is why people living in any part of the country, speaking any language become my friends. I convey my feelings to them and also like to listen to their views. I do not feel bad whenever there is criticism. These days I am being criticized a lot. I learn from such criticism and wherever necessary, change my policy and behaviour. But there are certain values, which I would like to adhere strictly to.  I do not compromise with values.

Mr. Prime Minister, you have been elected Head of the Cabinet three times and last time you were awarded as the ‘Best Head of the Cabinet in Asia’. It’s an onerous responsibility and a very important one, how do you fulfill this?

I fulfill my responsibility with the cooperation of all. I have faith in people and people have faith in me. I do not hide anything from the people. I do not hesitate in saying the right things. But I always keep an eye on the collective will of the people and always try to ensure that I am able to establish contact with the common man.

Under your leadership, Mr. Prime Minister, India has achieved a great deal of success in the economic field. What do you feel - which policies have helped you in achieving this success?

There has been a policy change in India in the last few years. Earlier we had such policies, which could help the country in facing different kinds of crisis. Thus, we laid emphasis on heavy industries. We were concerned about our defence. But now in our new policies we have made certain changes. We have framed policies, which are pragmatic and which have been worked out in keeping with the interests of the masses. There has been an improvement in the economic situation in India and we hope that this process of reforms will continue. We have always been against the ‘Quota Permit Raj’. It does not augur well that all the powers, all the rights are centralized in the hands of the Government. Government should be a facilitator, government should cooperate, government should prepare an environment for progress – it is very necessary. But if the government itself starts doing everything, then we cannot expect good results. Now with the new policies there is an improvement in India’s economic condition and we hope that there will be further improvement.

In your view what should we do to increase economic cooperation between Russia and India? Which one of the long-term schemes should we adopt and, in these, how could our cooperation in the military and technical fields be enhanced?

In the military field our cooperation is constantly growing. We depend a lot on our friend Russia. On a number of issues, in times of need, Russia has come to our help. It has been our endeavour - that our cooperation in the nuclear field should increase. We have faith in each other and that is why we are able to get such technology from Asia, which we are not able to get from other countries. Other countries try to place hurdles in the way. They do not want that the friendship between India and Russia should go deeper, or India should be provided with such technology, which they themselves would not like to part with. But we enjoy close relations with Russia and in this context can depend on Russia during any crisis.