Apropos Violations of the Spirit (Mar 25), it is facile to think that rape is only men assaulting women. Males raping males are going to be reported increasingly as the sex ratio gets more and more skewed. As it is, India is one of the few countries where there are more cases of sexually abused boys than girls.

 @Ramki. You are absolutely right. Gender wars will never make sense for the vast majority of people because men and women are connected. Most men and women dont really earn, struggle and live for themselves. 99% of their struggles are for the important men and women in their lives. That is why so many men protested on the streets after the delhi gang rape and that is why there is a growing number of women who are uneasy with the misuse of dowry laws. 

Another crude example to illustrate your point would be say, reservations. While in the case of caste based reservations it would be safe to assume that a person belonging to a lower caste person would support such a policy while a higher caste person is likely to oppose it. However if it was a hypothetical question of reservation for women in an enginering college. The father of a girl preparing for the entrance exam would support it and the mother of a boy competing for her seat would oppose it. 

 http://india.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/a-conversation-with-former-tihar-inmate-niranjan-kumar-mandal/

Thats the story of a man who was falsely accused and later cleared of a rape charge but lost four years of his life in the process, was tortured and he and his family are still treated as outcastes inspite of him being cleared. 

A false rape charge is unlike any other false charge. It is impossible to bounce back even after an acquital and the person is stigmatised for life. Hence there should be safeguards and misuse should be punished.

Also a rape undertrial's name too should not be revealed. In this politically correct atmosphere can't feminists have some empathy for the opposite gender

 It is incredible how intolerant the writer is of any view contrary to her's. She wants a draconian law but isn't willing to listen to let alone empathise with genuine worries men may have about its misuse. Feminists and leftists have this habit of dismissing any talk of safeguards by the standard  - ".. but every law can be misused". But the same people cried hoarse about the scope for misuse of laws such as tada and pota. Their hypocracy is unbelievable

 No sweat, feminists! Add this sentence and I will get this bill passed - 'capital punishment for those who lodge fake complaints'.

 Bonita >> Those who argue otherwise are either ignorant or dragging a red herring for reasons best known to themselves. Armed Forces Law (Army, Navy and Air Force Acts) specifically debars court martials from trying cases of rape against persons not subject to military law.

It is not ignorance or dragging red herring. it is just about rabble rousing. These folks have their own malignant agendas, and their own scarves to burn and armed forces are a convienient excuse.

OUTLOOK >> A draft bill on women’s security is bogged down trying to build safeguards for men 

What is exactly wrong in ensuring that a law on women's security is scritinized to ensure tha safeguards against misuse are not there?

OUTLOOK's FEMINAZISTS may love to live a lesbian lifestyle, and let them do so. But in real world, men and women are interdependent in infinite number of ways. The LEFTIST NEONAZIS would love to have a gender battle to pander their egos, but in real world, the real people like us work hard for livelihood and are not interested in gender battles.

I am for a strong law to secure woman and ensure that no one does the gender abuse act,but that is because the people I love around me are women. But it is equally important that some unrelated woman does not use this law to exploit me (as a worker, as a colleague, as a customer, as a business partner), because, if that is done the female dependants of me get hurt the most.

But this logic will never appeal to the FEMINAZIS who are conditioned to think that all people of one gender are plain evil

Maybe their own fathers, brothers, husbands and sons were evil harassers, but to conclude that all men are like that, only exposes their fascist mindset.

 Aswarudha >> First, counter to Rudy's “Imagine if the woman I have been married to for 20 years one day turns around and says I have raped her. It will shake the institution of marriage if marital rape is recognised as rape.”. It should not shake the institution, it should shake you rudy ! If a woman has finely got the guts to say to you, 'every time you had sex with me, it was rape',you should be wondering whether you marriage was like 'Rama and Sits' or "Ravana and Mandodari'.

Okay, let us allow a woman , married to a man for say 25 years, come to police station one fine morning, and complain that her hubby has been raping her for 25 years, please arrest and lock him up in jail for rest of his life.

Then, let us also allow a man - married to a woman for 25 years - to simply walk out of the wedding one fine day and say that he is no longer interested in living with her and is not also intersted in financially supporting her and let her find ways and means to live her life.

Just because Women were oppressed in earlier generations, we cannot have a INTER GENERATIONAL TRANSFER OF GUILT EXERCISE and punish present era men in the name of feminazist laws..

If that logic is used, let me also demand - as an Indian citizen that the British , who ruled us for 250 years, pay my grocery bills  since the brits taxed us to death in their regime and used the proceeds to enrich themselves.

How does this work?

Laws on rape should be bidirectional. And consistent. More importantly, must not leave any room for misuse.

And most importantly laws must be enacted in the interest of fairness, not because they please some pressure group.

Both Bonita and MU (who have disagreed a lot on many things) are agreeing that Martial Rape laws can be misused..

Which is indeed true....

 Bonita,

" To put it crudely (feminists please don't take umbrage), the old argument against marriage was "Why buy a cow, when milk is freely available?" Now it seems that even if one invests in a cow, there is no guarantee one will be allowed to milk it."

Sounds very crude but absolutely correct.

7 D "Marital rape is a very tricky question"

It is an anti-male law.

No tricks about it.

Marital rape is a very tricky questions. Many countries whose laws we ape have now included this as a crime. However, if a woman refuses to have sex with her husband, she should leave. She cannot claim all the rights and benefits of a marriage and simultaneously refuse to meet one of the obligations.

How do we reconcile marital rape with current widely reported tendency of women to have consensual sex and then yell "rape" when the boyfriend fails to marry.  To put it crudely (feminists please don't take umbrage), the old argument against marriage was "Why buy a cow, when milk is freely available?" Now it seems that even if one invests in a cow, there is no guarantee one will be allowed to milk it.

Cases of rape and sexual abuse by the armed forces in conflict areas is an equally sticky point.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - Neither AFSPA nor any other law offers any protection to armed forces personnel accused of rape or other sexual abuse in conflict areas or anywhere in this country. Those who argue otherwise are either ignorant or dragging a red herring for reasons best known to themselves. Armed Forces Law (Army, Navy and Air Force Acts) specifically debars court martials from trying cases of rape against persons not subject to military law.

4 D

The media should make males aware of the potent misuse of the law, so that they may wake up, and possibly politically protest - the way women do.

First, counter to Rudy's “Imagine if the woman I have been married to for 20 years one day turns around and says I have raped her. It will shake the institution of marriage if marital rape is recognised as rape.”. It should not shake the institution, it should shake you rudy ! If a woman has finely got the guts to say to you, 'every time you had sex with me, it was rape',you should be wondering whether you marriage was like 'Rama and Sits' or "Ravana and Mandodari'. This allegory is used since BJP espouses the 'Hindu culture'.

Secound - It is facile to think rape is only by men on women. Males raping males, is going to get reported (society is awaiting the male Nirbhaya) as the skewed sex ratio becomes more skewed. So, soon there will be no 'anti male bodies' bringing 'anti male legislation'.Just 'anti rape legislation'. The fact is, where all weapons to be banished or disappear, humans- male or females, will use the 'mind' (to instigate and control other humans ), the bare hands (brawn) and the male organ as the weapons of offence.this is true in any part of the world. What is really surprising, if you consider it,is that in Hinduism, the God of destruction is shown by the 'linga-yoni' combination. In other word, unbridled male aggression, the skewed sex ratio, the sheer over population and destruction of habitats will be Earth's ultimate revenge for over exploitation. May be Aliens are behind this ? The 'outside hand'. That way, all humans can excuse themselves from any responsibility.:-)

The media hype of the Delhi rape reached crescendo just before the controversial anti-male law was to be debated.

Only a moron can think this was merely coincidence and that the anti-male groups had no role to play in it.

The anti-male aims of the authors of these anti-male laws, is finally being questioned and challenged. This is good.

What is bad, is the media attempt to assume that 'safe guards' will be given to males. NOTHING of the sort will happen. 

It is a womans world - the judiciary included. 

“The Beasts of 16th December would prove to be the Adam Extinguisher as their Act may turn the Adam-Offspring Extinct.”

“The Beasts of 16th December would prove to be the Adam Extinguisher as their Act may turn the Adam-Offspring Extinct.”

The anti-male aims of the authors of these anti-male laws, is finally being questioned and challenged. This is good.

What is bad, is the media attempt to assume that 'safe guards' will be given to males. NOTHING of the sort will happen. 

It is a womans world - the judiciary included. 

The media hype of the Delhi rape reached crescendo just before the controversial anti-male law was to be debated.

Only a moron can think this was merely coincidence and that the anti-male groups had no role to play in it.

First, counter to Rudy's “Imagine if the woman I have been married to for 20 years one day turns around and says I have raped her. It will shake the institution of marriage if marital rape is recognised as rape.”. It should not shake the institution, it should shake you rudy ! If a woman has finely got the guts to say to you, 'every time you had sex with me, it was rape',you should be wondering whether you marriage was like 'Rama and Sits' or "Ravana and Mandodari'. This allegory is used since BJP espouses the 'Hindu culture'.

Secound - It is facile to think rape is only by men on women. Males raping males, is going to get reported (society is awaiting the male Nirbhaya) as the skewed sex ratio becomes more skewed. So, soon there will be no 'anti male bodies' bringing 'anti male legislation'.Just 'anti rape legislation'. The fact is, where all weapons to be banished or disappear, humans- male or females, will use the 'mind' (to instigate and control other humans ), the bare hands (brawn) and the male organ as the weapons of offence.this is true in any part of the world. What is really surprising, if you consider it,is that in Hinduism, the God of destruction is shown by the 'linga-yoni' combination. In other word, unbridled male aggression, the skewed sex ratio, the sheer over population and destruction of habitats will be Earth's ultimate revenge for over exploitation. May be Aliens are behind this ? The 'outside hand'. That way, all humans can excuse themselves from any responsibility.:-)

4 D

The media should make males aware of the potent misuse of the law, so that they may wake up, and possibly politically protest - the way women do.

Cases of rape and sexual abuse by the armed forces in conflict areas is an equally sticky point.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - Neither AFSPA nor any other law offers any protection to armed forces personnel accused of rape or other sexual abuse in conflict areas or anywhere in this country. Those who argue otherwise are either ignorant or dragging a red herring for reasons best known to themselves. Armed Forces Law (Army, Navy and Air Force Acts) specifically debars court martials from trying cases of rape against persons not subject to military law.

Marital rape is a very tricky questions. Many countries whose laws we ape have now included this as a crime. However, if a woman refuses to have sex with her husband, she should leave. She cannot claim all the rights and benefits of a marriage and simultaneously refuse to meet one of the obligations.

How do we reconcile marital rape with current widely reported tendency of women to have consensual sex and then yell "rape" when the boyfriend fails to marry.  To put it crudely (feminists please don't take umbrage), the old argument against marriage was "Why buy a cow, when milk is freely available?" Now it seems that even if one invests in a cow, there is no guarantee one will be allowed to milk it.

7 D "Marital rape is a very tricky question"

It is an anti-male law.

No tricks about it.

 Bonita,

" To put it crudely (feminists please don't take umbrage), the old argument against marriage was "Why buy a cow, when milk is freely available?" Now it seems that even if one invests in a cow, there is no guarantee one will be allowed to milk it."

Sounds very crude but absolutely correct.

Both Bonita and MU (who have disagreed a lot on many things) are agreeing that Martial Rape laws can be misused..

Which is indeed true....

 Aswarudha >> First, counter to Rudy's “Imagine if the woman I have been married to for 20 years one day turns around and says I have raped her. It will shake the institution of marriage if marital rape is recognised as rape.”. It should not shake the institution, it should shake you rudy ! If a woman has finely got the guts to say to you, 'every time you had sex with me, it was rape',you should be wondering whether you marriage was like 'Rama and Sits' or "Ravana and Mandodari'.

Okay, let us allow a woman , married to a man for say 25 years, come to police station one fine morning, and complain that her hubby has been raping her for 25 years, please arrest and lock him up in jail for rest of his life.

Then, let us also allow a man - married to a woman for 25 years - to simply walk out of the wedding one fine day and say that he is no longer interested in living with her and is not also intersted in financially supporting her and let her find ways and means to live her life.

Just because Women were oppressed in earlier generations, we cannot have a INTER GENERATIONAL TRANSFER OF GUILT EXERCISE and punish present era men in the name of feminazist laws..

If that logic is used, let me also demand - as an Indian citizen that the British , who ruled us for 250 years, pay my grocery bills  since the brits taxed us to death in their regime and used the proceeds to enrich themselves.

How does this work?

Laws on rape should be bidirectional. And consistent. More importantly, must not leave any room for misuse.

And most importantly laws must be enacted in the interest of fairness, not because they please some pressure group.

OUTLOOK >> A draft bill on women’s security is bogged down trying to build safeguards for men 

What is exactly wrong in ensuring that a law on women's security is scritinized to ensure tha safeguards against misuse are not there?

OUTLOOK's FEMINAZISTS may love to live a lesbian lifestyle, and let them do so. But in real world, men and women are interdependent in infinite number of ways. The LEFTIST NEONAZIS would love to have a gender battle to pander their egos, but in real world, the real people like us work hard for livelihood and are not interested in gender battles.

I am for a strong law to secure woman and ensure that no one does the gender abuse act,but that is because the people I love around me are women. But it is equally important that some unrelated woman does not use this law to exploit me (as a worker, as a colleague, as a customer, as a business partner), because, if that is done the female dependants of me get hurt the most.

But this logic will never appeal to the FEMINAZIS who are conditioned to think that all people of one gender are plain evil

Maybe their own fathers, brothers, husbands and sons were evil harassers, but to conclude that all men are like that, only exposes their fascist mindset.

 Bonita >> Those who argue otherwise are either ignorant or dragging a red herring for reasons best known to themselves. Armed Forces Law (Army, Navy and Air Force Acts) specifically debars court martials from trying cases of rape against persons not subject to military law.

It is not ignorance or dragging red herring. it is just about rabble rousing. These folks have their own malignant agendas, and their own scarves to burn and armed forces are a convienient excuse.

 No sweat, feminists! Add this sentence and I will get this bill passed - 'capital punishment for those who lodge fake complaints'.

 It is incredible how intolerant the writer is of any view contrary to her's. She wants a draconian law but isn't willing to listen to let alone empathise with genuine worries men may have about its misuse. Feminists and leftists have this habit of dismissing any talk of safeguards by the standard  - ".. but every law can be misused". But the same people cried hoarse about the scope for misuse of laws such as tada and pota. Their hypocracy is unbelievable

 http://india.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/a-conversation-with-former-tihar-inmate-niranjan-kumar-mandal/

Thats the story of a man who was falsely accused and later cleared of a rape charge but lost four years of his life in the process, was tortured and he and his family are still treated as outcastes inspite of him being cleared. 

A false rape charge is unlike any other false charge. It is impossible to bounce back even after an acquital and the person is stigmatised for life. Hence there should be safeguards and misuse should be punished.

Also a rape undertrial's name too should not be revealed. In this politically correct atmosphere can't feminists have some empathy for the opposite gender

 @Ramki. You are absolutely right. Gender wars will never make sense for the vast majority of people because men and women are connected. Most men and women dont really earn, struggle and live for themselves. 99% of their struggles are for the important men and women in their lives. That is why so many men protested on the streets after the delhi gang rape and that is why there is a growing number of women who are uneasy with the misuse of dowry laws. 

Another crude example to illustrate your point would be say, reservations. While in the case of caste based reservations it would be safe to assume that a person belonging to a lower caste person would support such a policy while a higher caste person is likely to oppose it. However if it was a hypothetical question of reservation for women in an enginering college. The father of a girl preparing for the entrance exam would support it and the mother of a boy competing for her seat would oppose it.