Ravi Press
Shakti puja: Savita, with mike, performing a yagna
andhra pradesh: women priests
The Oracles Of Devi
Female and backward caste. Andhra's women purohits breach the twin barriers with each puja.
The family purohit, the medium of communication with the Almighty for most Hindus, conforms to a stereotyped image—dhoti-clad, sacred thread across the chest, a smear of turmeric/sandalwood paste/ash on the forehead, and a tongue that unleashes an avalanche of shlokas and mantras. He is also usually defined by two crucial words: Brahmin; Male.

But those stereotypes are now crumbling in Andhra Pradesh. A group of women has not only stormed this traditional male bastion by turning professional purohits but have managed to prise open the once impenetrable caste barrier as well. Today, there are 20 practising women purohits in the state, most of them based in Hyderabad. Astound-ingly, about 90 per cent of them are OBCs. Most of these women have studied the Vedas, know Sanskrit and are degree holders from colleges certified by the Maharishi Dayanand University, Rohtak.

Vasudha Shastri, who performed the marriage of Telugu film actress Aarti Agarwal recently, exudes confidence at her job. "People used to the traditional purohits do look shocked when they see me conducting a marriage or a naming ceremony, but once they witness the actual rituals, they leave impressed," she says. A resident of the Aliabad area in Hyderabad's old city, Vasudha has performed over 1,000 marriages. She studied Sanskrit, the Vedas and the Upanishads in Varanasi, and when not conducting ceremonies and yagnas, teaches Sanskrit at the Nava Jeevan Mahila College. "When I conduct a shanti yagna, a marriage or a griha pravesh (house-warming), I make sure everyone understands the meaning of the Vedic mantras. The Vedas are meant for all; that should not be forgotten," she says.


Vaishnavi Devi at a family ceremony

Thirty-one-year-old Vaishnavi Devi, who has been a purohit since 1997, says she is usually flooded with compliments after performing a marriage ceremony. "When a couple ties the knot, they imbibe the true meaning of marriage if each and every mantra is explained to them." A teacher of Hindi and Sanskrit at the Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan School, Vaishnavi feels the growing acceptance of women as purohits has been fuelled by Hyderabad's increasingly cosmopolitan culture. "Several Punjabi and Rajasthani families invite me to conduct holy yagnas, marriages and naming ceremonies. Mahila purohits are more involved and effective, and this endears them to people," observes Vaishnavi. She adds that young people too often seek out women purohits—not only as an expression of their belief in gender equality, but also because they "want to be different". But, she adds, "While the tag of being 'different' does help our cause, the fact that we don't just think of it as a profession but as a means to deliver our culture to the next generation also helps."

Savita, 26, who has been a purohit for two years, has added the title 'Acharya' after doing a Masters in the Vedas and Sanskrit. "Traditional pandits had declared the Vedas out of reach for women. So when we go out and conduct holy rituals, it has also got something to do with women exercising their rights." Savita has travelled to Holland, Germany and Russia to conduct marriages, and feels what she has to offer is a happy mix of modern attitudes and traditional culture.

Another young purohit, Maitreyee, says she had initially come up against some prejudices. "People would often try to find out if I was a Brahmin. I would tell them that it is karma that makes one's caste," the 26-year-old says. A lecturer in Sanskrit, Maitreyee has a busy schedule, with at least 10 ceremonies a month marking her priestly calendar. Jyotisree, 32, has also often faced prejudices regarding her gender and caste, but says that she and other women purohits have learnt to take such attitudes in their stride. "Of course, people who are neck-deep in traditional beliefs tend to ask these questions. But then, answers follow only when questions are raised, and obstacles enable us to emerge stronger."


Jyotisree says she often faces gender and caste biases

Dalit rights activist and author of Why I Am Not A Hindu, Kancha Ilaiah, however, feels women purohits are groomed by institutions like Arya Samaj for dubious reasons. "Turning non-Brahmin women into Sanskrit-chanting vegetarians cannot in any way be termed progress. In trying to follow in the path of Brahmins, these women are actually regressing," says Ilaiah. "I liken the Arya Samaj luring these women into their fold to 'Hitlerite Aryanism' where women were indoctrinated into Nazi values."

V. Sandhya, state secretary of the Progressive Organisation of Women, also sounds a cynical note. "I know some of these women purohits. They are progressive and ought to be appreciated for breaking the barriers of the caste system and patriarchy. But at the same time, I feel they are succumbing to the same value system that sought to suppress them," she comments.

Arya Samaj state president Vittal Rao understandably takes a different view and says that when women breach ossified and hitherto sacrosanct caste barriers and perform all Hindu rituals—from naming ceremonies to the last rites—it is evidence of progress and acceptance of women as equals in every path of life.

M. Mohanachari, an electronics engineer at Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, who recently got a Vishwakarma yagna performed at his home by Savita, brushes aside all arguments and offers a simpler reason for choosing a woman purohit. "My wife and I chose Savita because we felt her knowledge of the Vedic rituals was perfect. Most of us need purohits at some point, so why not someone genuinely qualified? Gender does not matter." Vaishnavi, Savita and their tribe would say tathastu to that.

 
Daily MailPublished
COLLAPSE COMMENTS :
HAVE YOUR SAY
Jun 01, 2008 12:00 AM
50
Please allow me to congratulate you on a wonderful article on women priests. It is disappointing to hear some people bow down to our female Gods like Durga, Saraswati and such but turn around and say that that the Vedas are out of reach of Women? I, for one, am glad to see them.

What puzzles me is why a non-Hindu is allowed to voice his opinion, you are either in or out, what business is it of yours to comment on our faith? From what I gather, other faiths like Christianity & Islam also prohibit women priests; I don’t see this person commenting on them!

I only wish that more Hindus would talk about the great values that Hinduism teaches. Let’s take a few issues:

Why is India a shining democracy while Pakistan lurches from one despot to another? Why is that two peoples with a shared history going back thousands of years took such a divergent path once they gained Independence? What is the only difference? Religion! While Pakistan follows an Abrahamic faith where God talks like an Autocrat - My way is the only way, if you don't follow me, bad things will happen to you - whereas Hindus are taught to respect all faiths. All good souls regardless of their faith are welcome in God Rama's heaven - Muslims, christians, Atheists, Gays, life forms from other planets, you name it - are welcome. In the words of Dr. Martin Luther King - A man should be judged by his character - and that is what Hinduism teaches. The British did not teach us democracy, Hindus already knew it.

Another facet of democracy is a secular society. Ever wonder why while India gave birth to a multitude of faiths, like Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism, - Christian and muslim lands had only one? It's not like people did not try to start other faiths, but when and if anyone dared to, they were quickly branded as heretics and put to death! If the Buddha had been born in Europe in the middle ages, he would have been tortured to death! His teachings consigned to the fire, lost forever and there would be no Buddhism today. Even some of their own people had to flee to America to escape persecution. People of other faiths like the Parsees & Bohras fled muslim lands and found safe refuge in India. India is a multitude of faiths because Hindus never seek to abuse or mock other faiths, tolerated different ideas and let people create other faiths as they deemed fit.

Pakistan finally seems to be on its way to being a democracy. Surprise, the religious parties were routed in the elections! When Afghanistan became an islamic society under the Taliban, democracy flew out of the window. This is the reason why western countries came up with the idea of Separation of Church and State.

But Indians need to keep in mind that not all faiths are alike. In India the situation is reversed. India will remain a thriving democracy and a secular state as long as it remains Hindu.
Vanamali Thotapalli
Chicago, United States
Jan 22, 2008 12:00 AM
49
Now, here is a question for all the followers of Abrahamic religions. Do they have the guts to allow women to become priests, maulanas or rabbis?

Vishwanath Rao
Bangalore, India
Jan 19, 2008 12:00 AM
48
Women and low castes replacing Brahmins - this is great news.
This had been in Arya Samaj's statement of mission since its inception a century and half ago. Now it looks like they are getting their act together.

What's happening is much bigger than mere rituals. It is direct revolt against the fundamental of brahmanical system : unequality based on gender and caste. A few decade ago it was unimaginable. Now this model needs to be replicated all over the sub-continent.
Also, it is not about religion. All faiths including Christianity and Islam in India are influence by the caste system. Church leadership is dominated by the upper castes. That also need change.
Rajesh
Phoenix, United States
Jan 18, 2008 12:00 AM
47
Mr or Ms J from Bangalore, I am not an Indian to hide behind initials, aliases and pseudonyms. I am what I am and proud of it. I do not believe in conspiracy theories nor am I part of them.

I post these observations from Karachi and trust Dogpile, Google and Yahoo for Search Engines. No, I am Joseph Michael and not Jan Mohammed. I am not from India but was in India till 12th. February 1948.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 18, 2008 12:00 AM
46
Idli Dosa,

You said: "The U.K based Guardian says Ganesha is a gay festival"


http://www.guardian.co....ewyear.liverpool?page=4


>> It seems like too much of the rice flour is clogging your brain cells. Read the guardian article properly before making stupid allegations like this. The guardian did NOT call ganesh chaturthi a gay festival. Since Ganesha is the remover of obstacles, lets pray that he removes the obstacles to logic in your brain.
Anand
Santa Clara, USA
Jan 18, 2008 12:00 AM
45
>>About Parks, we have the biggest one in South Asia recently built around the Jahangir Kothari Parade,

Good for you. Enjoy it to the max till it lasts.

There may be a fatwa tomorrow against a stroll in the park , just as there is a fatwa against music and movies in your great country now.

And do skip the visit to this park , if your neighbourhood suicide bomber also has the place in his itinerary same day.

We will miss the "varierty " you bring in if a suicide bomber insists on sharing his quota of 72 virgins in heaven with you.
Shankar
Bangalore, India
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
44
Mr. Shankar, I am a Karnataka Catholic. This for the record.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
43
There is no right or wrong here. It was merely a Cut and Paste about Practices affecting Women in Hinduism. There was no Value Judgement, Mr. Shankar.

About Parks, we have the biggest one in South Asia recently built around the Jahangir Kothari Parade,


http://karachi.metblogs.../01/bagheibnqasim.phtml


----------------------------------------------------

I see no reason to leave this Forum. Apart from variety, I add much needed balance to it.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
42
Joseph,

Come to Bengaluru. I will sponsor unlimited joyrides in cubbon parks toy train for you, if you promise not to lie in future. ( I will also throw in unlimited pop corn and soda, if you stop gracing this forum for good)

BTW, do you accept that you were wrong about Johar?
Shankar
Bangalore, India
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
41
When did I say, Mr. Shankar about the greatest Religion on earth. Your hatred is palpable.

I asked Jyoteka to introspect at Sydney's Opera House. Bangaluru is not the same as when my uncle was Deputy Commissioner Police there and Richard Town was pristine.

May be this place will do to clear some of the hate within
you.

--------------------------------------
--------------

Cubbon Park. A 121 ha (300 acre) green lung in the center of the city. Sitting in the shade of one its many magnificent trees and watching towering bamboo sway in the breeze, it is hard to imagine that you in the heart of a metropolis of over 6.0 million people and one of the world's most dynamic and fastest growing cities. There is also a toy train offering children's rides.


------------------------------------------
----------

On the toy train will, perhaps, be excellent.

Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
40
It will be wonderful, Mr. Vinod, if you post an update on the Internet. Thank You.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
39
Mulla Joseph, Women and their status in your greatest religion on earth.

" Bukhari Volume 1, Book 6, Number 301:

Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:
Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle ?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."
hell for the most trivial things like displeasing their husbands.

Bukhari Volume 2, Book 18, Number 161:

Narrated 'Abdullah bin Abbas:
I also saw the Hell-fire and I had never seen such a horrible sight. I saw that most of the inhabitants were women." The people asked, "O Allah's Apostle! Why is it so?" The Prophet replied, "Because of their ungratefulness." It was asked whether they are ungrateful to Allah. The Prophet said, "They are ungrateful to their companions of life (husbands) and ungrateful to good deeds. If you are benevolent to one of them throughout the life and if she sees anything (undesirable) in you, she will say, 'I have never had any good from you.' "
Bukhari Volume 4, Book 54, Number 460:

Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah's Apostle said, "If a husband calls his wife to his bed (i.e. to have sexual relation) and she refuses and causes him to sleep in anger, the angels will curse her till morning."

This is the most benevolent religion of GDP Joseph , which sees no difference between wife and a sexual slave.


http://www.faithfreedom.../women_before_islam.htm
Shankar
Bangalore, India
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
38
>>Mass Wife-Burning (Jauhar) - Often 100s are burnt at a time.

When defeat became certain in a war, it was considered proper to fight to the last breath, but to avoid capture and dishonour of royal women, Jauhar was committed. The torture and dishonour at the hands of invading Muslim armies was almost certain. In some cases, such as with Chittaurgarh in 1568 the victorious Mughal invaders put the entire remaining population of thirty thousand souls to death.

Your friend google says this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jauhar


GDP joseph forgets that invading muslim armies raped and converted hindu women, if they won a war. Johar was the answer of proud women who chose death , instead of dishonour by your forefathers.

100s and 1000s were burnt to death , if they did not convert by your Islamic armies.
Shankar
Bangalore, India
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
37
Jyoteka, have you boarded the train for Circular Quays?. Good!

En passant, as most members in this Forum, think I lie, I now trust Google for my ripostes. Happy tavelling and happier reading.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
36











Death by Fire: Sati, Dowry Death and Female Infanticide in Modern India/Mala Sen. New Delhi, Penguin, 2001, xiv, 270 p., $14. ISBN 0-14-302766-2.

"The ancient practice of sati, the self-immolation of a woman on her husband’s funeral pyre, was outlawed by the British administration in India in 1829. The practice was believed to have died out, but the fate of Roop Kanwar, an eighteen-year-old Rajasthani woman who was burned on her husband’s funeral pyre in 1987, changed that perception. Mala Sen, author of the acclaimed biography of Phoolan Devi, India’s notorious Bandit Queen, explores the reality of life and death for women in modern India in this illuminating and terrifying study. The book is part journey through the India that Sen knows and loves and part exploration of the enigma that India still remains in the minds of many. Starting with Roop Kanwar, Sen enters the worlds of three women: a goddess, a burned bride and a woman accused of killing her daughter. The author shows how, in this society in which ancient and modern apparently co-exist comfortably, there increasingly is real cause for alarm. She describes a state in which political turmoil is constantly at the surface and in which the role of women is constantly being redefined."

Return to Women's Studies Catalogue

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Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
35
>> NOT TO BE SET BY ME...BUT SET BY A WOMAN!!!

If a Muslim is advocating equal rights for a woman, you are going to interrupt him with your intrusive questions? Your hatred for Muslims seems to trump your commitment to women's rights. You start out by agreeing with the worst bigots in this forum, and then you claim you have greater rights to speak on liberty than I have!
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
34
Yes, Jyoteks, yes, I know about Islam and live amidst 152 million of its adherents at present.

All Religions have their 'weaknesses'. However, the good they provide is greater. One needs courage to see Religion in its totallity and not through its 'negative' segments.

At present, our Pope is in a fix. This does not mean I change my set of beliefs.

Who banned Sati, Jyoteka?. Not you?. Who revived Sati in 'modern' India?. Not you, again. Enlargen your vision, please.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
33
When in Sydney, and I need to reflect, I visit the area around the Opera House, pick up a beer or an ice cream, the latter from a small shack run by a Bangladeshi alonside the Botanical Gardens Gate, and stare out toward the sea lost in thought. It is a great equaliser, Jyoteka. Try it.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
32
NOT TO BE SET BY ME...BUT SET BY A WOMAN!!!
Jyoteka Marwaha
Sydney, Australia
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
31
HEY JOSEPH
talking about most oppressive system....just to increase your general knowledge...have you ever heard about ISLAMIC FAITH???If not please...
Jyoteka Marwaha
Sydney, Australia
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
30
HEY JOSEPH
talking about most oppressive system....just to increase your general knowledge...have you ever heard about ISLAMIC FAITH???If not please...
Jyoteka Marwaha
Sydney, Australia
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
29
Hey Joseph...
In which ERA u are living...try to realise!!!
Jyoteka Marwaha
Sydney, Australia
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
28
Mention one complete faith or religion....I am lucky without any doubt...but my religion is improving...giving an example of 2 centuries back is not a quite relevant example here!! it well depicts the positive changes..

I dont intend to widen the Gap but its time to improve...get rid of old, worhtless, crapiest thoughts...with time everything changes...How LONG YOU GUYS WILL TAKE GIVE LIBERTY to your women folk?
I am no doubt lucky...but I WANT EVERY WOMEN to be equally lucky!!
I am a human who has desires, dreams, aspirations...and if somebody tells me Islamic women dont have such desires, dreams and aspirations, probably needs another life to realise that!! I wasn born in a simple HINDU family....and I was given the opportunity by a male of hindu religion who didnt try to abort me or discriminate on the name of girl child and today I am his pride.
"Yes, it is exigent upon Muslims that must vehemently eschew the Talibanic interpretation of the Muslim faith to escape the mires of squalor, deprivation and illiteracy."
Y women wear BURKA??
Again a basic question,'Is it really wrong If an Islamic woman discards BURKA?If it is...what is wrong in that?


Jyoteka Marwaha
Sydney, Australia
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
27
Aryan-Vaishnavism (Hinduism) is the most oppressive system on record in its suppression of women. From conception to death, woman had to suffer in uncountable ways (details after the basic section) :
Child Marriage - Girls are to be married when 5 years old !
Dowry - Vedas prescribe this pracitice
Bride-Burning - if the dowry is insufficient
No Property
Mass Wife-Burning (Jauhar) - Often 100s are burnt at a time.
Widow-Burning (Sati) - Sanctioned by the Vedas, Puranas, practiced by Krishna's wives, it still continues.

----------------------------------------------
------
We are all naked here and should not throw stones at others. God Bless.
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
26
Women in Indo-Aryan Society
Table of Contents
1. Girls
1.1 Female Infanticide
1.2 Child Marriage
2. Women
2.1 Burning of Women
2.1.1 Bride-Burning
2.1.2 Wife-Burning
2.1.3 Jauhar
2.1.4 Witch Burning
2.1.5 Widow-Burning
2.2 Punishments
2.3 Restrictions
2.3.1 No Property
2.3.2 Dress and Veiling
2.3.3 Dowry
2.3.4 Staying Alone
2.3.5 Going Out
2.3.6 No Divorce
2.3.7 No Remarriage
Joseph
Karachi, Pakistan
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
25
Jyoteka,

>> a simple advice..BEFORE TALKING OF LIBERTY ISSUE, RESPECT YOUR BETTER HALVES...

What an execrable advice! She is saying, "Before you speak of liberties, you have to meet certain tests, to be set by her!!!" I already said in an earlier post that I was talking to both Hindus and Muslims. How do people become such unbearbale boors?
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
24
Good Going Vinod...Rightly said

In my opinion Hindusim is the most liberal religion where Queens sat with Kings to participate in court and day to day running of the Kingdom in the gone era. Hindu religion was influenced by the mughal empire which was for sure an Islamic era.
Residing in a Western Nation I come across numerous Muslim Men who are not with their spouses here and liberty is just meant for them. My basic question for the Muslim Men,'Do you give the same liberty to your spouses as well?'
and a simple advice..BEFORE TALKING OF LIBERTY ISSUE, RESPECT YOUR BETTER HALVES...
Jyoteka Marwaha
Sydney, Australia
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
23
Equlality is proven when men and women are on the same platform. Financial Independence brings equality and Fianancial Independence is possible only with working, getting recognition in your work. When you talk about different professions like nursing, teaching...they are jobs if taken seriously.No doubt Women work to increase household Income but on the other hand to let the Men know if tomorrow marriage fails she will not be on his mercy and take the crap.

Working is a bigger concept which includes recognition of your rights, knowing your worth in professional market, enhancement of your professional personality which influences your over all personality.
I support Women should work they are just not meant for House hold...Men do need to take more of Paternal leaves.
Jyoteka Marwaha
Sydney, Australia
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
22
>> But I reject the notion that women have to work to prove they are equal.

They do not work to prove that they are equal. They work to increase family income or to exercise their independence. They should have more options than being a housewife, a nurse, a teacher or a secretary.
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
21
" Paying lip service to the concept of equality is not enough"

Who said I pay lip service to the concept of equality. I dont. In my view, women and men are different. There is no need to "prove" equality. I am for equal pay regardless of sex. But I reject the notion that women have to work to prove they are equal. The whole of equality has become making women do things men do-in the hope that it proves equality. Thats a wrong premise to start with.

"You want to block women from entire career lines in today's world in which workplace has become not only a locus of power but of independence"

I am totally against women in army. In police, I prefer a very limited role.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
20
>> If you look at all the clamour for women in army, police and now this (performing rituals).

You want to block women from entire career lines in today's world in which workplace has become not only a locus of power but of independence! Paying lip service to the concept of equality is not enough (for the dopish, let me again say that I am talking to both Hindus and Muslims).
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
19
"This later degenrated into a permanent blanket ban on performing rituals."

May be. May be not. But I reject the entire premise of the article which is based on feminism and that is if women do the things men do, then women are equal to men. If you look at all the clamour for women in army, police and now this, it all points to a very low self image of these women. They feel so bad about being a women that they have this urge to "prove" something by trying to be a man.

Thats why the whole article and concept behind it is absurd.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
18
Also i disagree with someone's comment on burqa. I recently was on a trip to the andes.. the sun was brutal and gave me first degree burns on the face. All this on my wheatish skin. And after that i had to keep my face covered with a towel like a ninja :-)
So burqa is a very good idea for women folk in the arabian region.

But like any other religious monopoly, this became one of the mullahs' many levers over the people.
bhushan
richmond, United States
Jan 17, 2008 12:00 AM
17
Ganesan is right.. women are not forbidden to study the scriptures, but under certain circumstances forbidden to perform rituals. This later degenrated into a permanent blanket ban on performing rituals.

The certain circumstances are pregnency and periods. During rituals, the hymns cant be recited silently in one's mind. A lot of emphasis is on correct pronounciation and usage of phonetics. Some of the guttral syllables come from deep and strong exhalation and inhalations which are often not good in those circumstances. Even performing many yoga asanas are not good when pregnent or menstruating.

bhushan
richmond, United States
Jan 15, 2008 12:00 AM
16
It is regrettable that once again, every issue becomes a Hindu-Muslim argument. I've seen so many Hindu posters make comments on Islam and Christianity - what is wrong with Mr. Faruki commenting on this article? And it is not even a faith issue, it is an issue of practice.

There is no doubt that women have been given far less importance in muslim countries and in India. Instead of trying to solve the problem, we seem to become satisfied by pointing fingers!

Ghulam, I salute your efforts to bring about change in muslim communities. I fully support women priests and lower caste priests in Hindu temples. The Kanchi paramacharya was a holy man but he was not an authority on the incredibly diverse hindu faith.

People like Ganesan are free not to invite female priests to their homes or not attend temples that have female priests. The rest of us can support such progressive measures.
Anand
Santa Clara, USA
Jan 14, 2008 12:00 AM
15
>>Women do join prayers in many mosques, but are separated by a curtain or some such device.

Over 60% of the mosques in UK, do not allow women to enter and pray , as per link given earlier. ( inspite of curtain, wall, burqa whatever ). You should be leadig protest against this practice amongst believers first. Your questions to the Kanchi sree can wait on Hindu practices IMO.

>>The discussion with Ganesan however was about women conducting prayer services.

When muslim women are not even allowed entry to mosques, how will they conduct prayer services? through video conference?

>>This is not a Hindu/Muslim problem. Religious institutions of the Protestants, Roman Catholics, Muslims and Hindus have all resisted the idea of women clergy.

It becomes a universal problem AFTER similar inhuman practices amongst believers are pointed out. Till then it was a convenient stick to beat the Hindus and the kanchi seer with.
Shankar
Bangalore, India
Jan 14, 2008 12:00 AM
14
HappyRam/Minu,

>> MUSLIMS IN INDIA AND WORLD OVER DO NOT ALLOW WOMAN TO JOIN PRAYERS IN MOSQUES.

Women do join prayers in many mosques, but are separated by a curtain or some such device. The discussion with Ganesan however was about women conducting prayer services. About six months ago, I wrote a letter to Milligazette saying that women should be allowed to lead namaaz in mosques. I was roundly upbraided for my views. About 2 or 3 years ago Outlook had an article on a Muslim woman in WB leading prayers in a mosque, and I had posted my pleasure at that news.

This is not a Hindu/Muslim problem. Religious institutions of the Protestants, Roman Catholics, Muslims and Hindus have all resisted the idea of women clergy. Progress in this area is slow.
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 14, 2008 12:00 AM
13
>>Are you saying that you deny women the right to perform rituals just because the Kanchi Seer says so?

"TEPHANIE KENNEDY: The civil liberties group, the Muslim Public Affairs Committee, estimates that women are banned from attending 60 per cent of mosques in the UK.

Robert Kilroy-Silk, an Independent Member of the European Parliament, is an outspoken and controversial right-wing politician.

He argues that banning women from mosques is gender discrimination, and he's calling on the British Government and the European Commission to step in and legislate to ensure women are given equal rights."


http://www.abc.net.au/c...ntent/2007/s1908745.htm


Mia , forget rituals , you do not even allow women to enter your mosques !

Secular Bade Mia should ask his local mosque to admit women before asking Kanchi Seer for explantion on Hindus.
Shankar
Bangalore, India
Jan 14, 2008 12:00 AM
12
>>And since many of the South Indian temples resemble commercial enterprises, because the offerings run into crores of rupees, Government of India must take control of such temples..

You have absolutely no Idea what you are talking about. The Government has already taken over running of all majot temples in India. There is a Muzrai department to specially do this. Ofcpoutse being "secular" . this department takes over only Hindu Temples, mosques and churches are not touched.

What about offerings running to crores in Mosques and churches in India ? Are you for taking over of Mosques and churches also by government ?

Temples have already been taken over, now you shouls volunteer and surrender control of mosques to the government.
Shankar
Bangalore, India
Jan 13, 2008 12:00 AM
11
>> I dont have the capacity or the talent to explain the reasoning of the Kanchi Seer, I refuse to explain why women should not perform rituals.

Are you saying that you deny women the right to perform rituals just because the Kanchi Seer says so?
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 13, 2008 12:00 AM
10
"You said in this forum that women should be forbidden from performing rituals, but you refuse to say why! "

Actually in the larger scheme of things, the only person in this forum who does any research and backs his argument with data is me.

Since the current issue is beyond my scope and I dont have the capacity or the talent to explain the reasoning of the Kanchi Seer, I refuse to explain why women should not perform rituals. Interested people are requested to do their own study.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 13, 2008 12:00 AM
9
>> Once in a while I expect people to do their own research.

You said in this forum that women should be forbidden from performing rituals, but you refuse to say why!
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 13, 2008 12:00 AM
8
"You can't tell us? "

No. Once in a while I expect people to do their own research.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 13, 2008 12:00 AM
7
>> Go and read the late Kanchi Seer's works to find the answer.

You can't tell us?
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 13, 2008 12:00 AM
6
"Why?"

Go and read the late Kanchi Seer's works to find the answer.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 13, 2008 12:00 AM
5
Ganesan,

>> Learning vedas is not prohibited for woman. But performing rituals are. And I think it should stay that way.

Why?
Ghulam Y Faruki
New York, United States
Jan 12, 2008 12:00 AM
4
""I liken the Arya Samaj luring these women into their fold to 'Hitlerite Aryanism' where women were indoctrinated into Nazi values"

These guys are really funny. They cannot come with an analogy that does not include calling others nazists. These guys are so obsessed.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 12, 2008 12:00 AM
3
""Traditional pandits had declared the Vedas out of reach for women"

This is a lie to begin with. In Adi Sankara's life, he debates Mandana Mishra. And the judge happens to be the wife of Mandana Mishra-who is described as learned, well versed in vedas and knew the truth.

Learning vedas is not prohibited for woman. But performing rituals are. And I think it should stay that way.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 12, 2008 12:00 AM
2
The late Kanchi Seer was dead against such practices. And I follow him on this. This is a tamasha that need to stop.
Ganesan
Nj, USA
Jan 12, 2008 12:00 AM
1
It is wonderful to see women and people from the so called "backward" castes become priests. For too long, hindus have let Brahmins be the guardians of our ancient texts. And for too long, we have performed our rituals with absolutely no understanding of the chants or the verses.

Expectedly, the statements of Kancha Iliah and V Sandhya are in poor taste. Why should Hindus need advise on rituals from someone like Iliah who's ostensibly anti Hindu and bothered to write "Why I am Not a Hindu." It is like having muslims get Salman Rushdie's opinion on religious matters.
Anand
Santa Clara, USA
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